#cisco
29 December 2007
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--- Log opened Sat Dec 29 00:00:03 2007
--- Day changed Sat Dec 29 2007
00:00 <****> i tried using odbc for some databas eobjects
00:00 <****> if you had tons ofd diagrams, like 1000+
00:00 <****> i could never make it look pretty
00:00 <****> no, it should all be time stamped
00:00 <****> if the last update was 12/1/07 and the last upload was 11/1/07 you know the drawing is wrong
00:01 <****> why not have all the information in the database update the drawing
00:01 <****> might be to much of a pain :P
00:02 <****> i would asume that the drawing is a pdf
00:03 <****> visio, copy like ip's in use, total, circuit id, everything
00:03 <****> some of us do not want to run the ms prg and visio backend
00:03 <****> also not really a lite web client interface
00:04 <****> you'd have to run it, it's for work
00:04 <****> that you can get info about on you cell phone browser when you are stuck with a network down
00:04 <****> and no viso client on your laptop you got from the guy next to you
00:04 <****> you could fix that
00:05 <****> or better, you have visio 2003 and you get a 20007 drawing...
00:05 <****> you can display visios in ie
00:05 <****> -0
00:05 <****> right, i can do that on my blackberry or iphone?
00:05 <****> or plam
00:05 <****> not sure what you're talking about, visios pretty much the standard for network diagrams
00:05 <****> when i have no access to the net other then that cuz the network i am trying to fix is down
00:06 <****> you can export a visio to png
00:06 <****> not sure a network diagram on your blackberry or iphone is going to be all the useful though
00:06 <****> i think the idea for the db was to have something you can get to via the web
00:06 <****> ASCSI drawings is the most compatible way :)
00:06 <****> ASCII haha
00:06 <****> nemith, if you can upload a pdf of the network then by all means. i can view it on my iphone.
00:06 <****> and plam
00:06 <****> heh, vi have some old drawings in ascii for the old IBM 2210 routers
00:07 <****> isn't like Kiefer a drink or something
00:07 <****> the problem with it of course is that once it's a pdf you cannot edit it
00:07 <****> milk cultured
00:07 <****> all drawing maintained on an old mainframe...
00:07 <****> you can use a macro that triggers in visio to save in pdf/png the same time you save in vsd
00:07 <****> nemith i do not want some noc monkey fucking up my nice clean drawing.
00:07 <****> Dimik: A drink? ... never heard that one before?
00:07 <****> i would asume that someone is responsible for the drawing.
00:08 <****> there could be a tag that emails the author of the change.
00:08 <****> Bawbatos: i want the noc monkeys to do the digrams for me :P
00:08 <****> okay :)
00:08 <****> Bawbatos: We use Domino Doc for drawings and versions. But that is definately not the best system...
00:09 <****> I wish I could hav esomeone do diagrams for me
00:09 <****> i never found one that did not mess up my perfect drawing
00:09 * Bawbatos is anal
00:09 <****> can an automated scan test if it is disrupting services itself
00:09 <****> nemith: I would never put that responsible on a noc person
00:09 <****> well i didn't mean NOC actually
00:09 <****> I mean my underlings
00:10 <****> you can't have one person in charge of all digraming
00:10 <****> heh, ok. That sounds better
00:10 <****> I have grown to hate visio, for sure
00:10 <****> nah the scan can't, that'd be very hard to do
00:10 <****> 2007 is alright I guess
00:10 <****> if it were me the drawing would have a maintainer in the db. if there was a change it would get flag as invalid and the maintainer would get an email saying dude, fix it.
00:11 <****> no reason you could not forward it to and underling.
00:11 <****> sartan: i'll do you diagrams for you
00:11 <****> Well, if you have a large scale network its hard to have one person in charge of the drawing.
00:11 <****> `tim: in mspaint?
00:11 <****> I think network diagrams are akin to home schematics
00:11 <****> 2 bedroom home, 1 engineer
00:11 <****> and to be honest i would rather have a kinda crappy digram then have a non-updated, or worse non-existant diagram
00:11 <****> sure.. i'll do them in notepad if you got enough $$ :)
00:12 <****> after seeing some of the drawings people have done i am not sure you should not need a licensee or something to do it :)
00:12 <****> 40 unit apartment complex, probably enough people to do it
00:12 <****> the best solution i have seen was at my last job
00:12 <****> damn. autocorrect
00:12 <****> You know what could be useful is a global network documentation standard.
00:12 <****> There aren't even guidelines for this
00:12 <****> we hired someone whose sole job was to keep diagrams and the nms tools up to date
00:12 <****> I have a doc standard for the guys at work, and it's not even good, just consistent
00:13 <****> databases, flow charts, business analysis, whatever. doc standards. Network guys have "switch=square router=round"
00:13 <****> Its more like, If you change the network, you change the drawing as well.
00:13 <****> i have a problem with scaling my docs properly for the job
00:13 <****> i get way too detailed, or way too high level
00:13 <****> "this router also connects to this environment, so I may as well draw it"
00:13 <****> I always do mine at 11x17
00:14 <****> sartan: I usually do a cloud if the router connect to another system
00:14 <****> size h paper baby! ftw
00:14 <****> and no picture icons. lines only damn it.
00:14 <****> also, i tend to use equipment pictures
00:14 <****> haha
00:14 <****> Ick.
00:15 <****> I found that the people I work around/with tend not to buy things if they are little blocks
00:15 <****> heh
00:15 <****> if they are pretty pictures, they will cut a PO straight out
00:15 <****> it should look like a blue print not my 4 year olds colouring book
00:15 <****> type0 well you need to work for people that are not fucking dumbasses :)
00:15 <****> this is a fact.
00:16 <****> maybe my new acquired SMBE will help me with that goal.
00:16 <****> newly, even
00:16 <****> I am going through all these hoops just to get NFR shit
00:16 <****> Well, no matter how good your drawing is, the server dudes will not understand it anyway ;-)
00:17 <****> jj
00:17 <****> if you have a good drawing and they do not get it, ice pick and the right eye thru the tear duct
00:17 <****> http://www.mistrust.ca/tmp/6509s.png <- server dude version
00:18 <****> Yeah see? you get redundancy by connecting to -two- switches. Yeah!
00:19 <****> this drawing pretty much tells me nothing. some blue boxes connected at some point
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